ZOOM Meeting summary for Edwin Rutsch's Personal Meeting Room (02/11/2025)
Quick recap
Edwin and Jodie discussed the political bias in academic literature on empathy and conservatism, and the potential for empathy to bridge political divides. They also explored the concept of empathy in various contexts, including personal growth, understanding, and its role in leadership. Lastly, they considered the balance between active listening and task-oriented leadership, and the importance of practicality and action in their work.
Next steps
• Jodie to listen to the Thomas Gordon Parent Effectiveness Training audio book during her commute.
• Jodie to review Edwin's list of blocks to empathy on the project page.
• Edwin to go through the basic model of empathy definition in a future meeting.
• Jodie to share her practical model of empathy and map it onto the empathy circle concept in the next meeting.
• Edwin to consider ways Jodie can get involved with the board or get trained in facilitating empathy circles.
• Jodie to explore bringing empathy circles to her location.
Summary
Addressing Political Bias in Empathy
Edwin and Jodie discuss the political bias in academic literature on empathy and conservatism. Jodie shares findings that paint conservatives negatively and liberals positively, but notes this doesn't align with her personal experiences. Edwin emphasizes the importance of bringing all stakeholders together in an empathic dialogue, using tools like the empathy circle to foster understanding between different viewpoints. They agree that empathy can be a valuable approach to bridge political divides and address complex issues.
Empathy, Role-Playing, and Holistic Approach
Jodie and Edwin discussed the concept of empathy and its application in various contexts. Edwin shared his experience with Daryl Davis, who successfully befriended KKK members through deep listening and empathy. Jodie expressed interest in conducting an empirical study on the effects of the empathy circle on long-term empathy levels. They considered two separate studies: one for Jodie's experiment and another for a longitudinal study with the empathy circle. Jodie also mentioned her plan to create her own empathy scale. Edwin proposed the idea of defining empathy within the context of an empathy circle, allowing for role-playing and better understanding of empathy-related concepts. They also discussed the potential for a holistic approach to empathy, emphasizing the importance of sensing into the experiences of others and oneself. Lastly, Jodie mentioned that her academic friend, Lee Wong, would join their next meeting to provide insights from a holistic perspective.
Empathy, Humility, and Personal Growth
Jodie and Edwin discussed the concept of empathy and its role in personal growth and understanding. Edwin shared his experience with the empathy tent at a political rally and how it led to a deeper connection with others. They also discussed the fear of change as a potential barrier to empathy, with Jodie mentioning her interest in intellectual humility as a related concept. Edwin agreed that humility is an important aspect of empathy, and they both acknowledged the potential for personal growth through active listening and empathy. Jodie expressed her interest in further exploring the overlap between empathy and humility.
Balancing Listening and Task-Oriented Leadership
Jodie and Edwin discussed the balance between active listening and task-oriented leadership in their respective roles. Edwin shared how their organization, focused on building a culture of empathy, incorporates active listening and conflict resolution through empathy circles. They also discussed the importance of practicality and action in their work. Jodie expressed interest in getting involved with Edwin's organization and suggested sharing a practical model of empathy she developed. They agreed to continue refining their understanding of empathy and its application in their work.
https://otter.ai/u/RM5QVFlh_AXlNcNwC6-K7iHAAKs?view=transcript
Edwin Rutsch and Jodie Jenson discussed the politicization of empathy research, noting a significant bias towards liberal academics. Jodie highlighted a study showing increased empathy for out-group members among liberals but decreased empathy among conservatives exposed to violent media. Edwin emphasized the importance of empathy circles in fostering dialogue and understanding across political divides. They explored the concept of holistic empathy and the challenges of empathizing with multiple groups. Jodie proposed a longitudinal study on the effects of empathy circles, while Edwin suggested role-playing empathy blocks and roadblocks to empathy. They also discussed the potential for empathy circles to address community conflicts and promote intellectual humility.
[ ] Explore conducting a longitudinal study on the effects of the empathy circle approach on empathy levels.
[ ] Review the resources on "blocks to empathy" and the audio recording of Thomas Gordon's work.
[ ] Consider ways Jodie can get involved with the board or training to help further the mission of the empathy circle approach.
[ ] Refine the basic model of the empathy circle definition and discuss how Jodie's practical model of empathy can be mapped onto it.
Edwin Rutsch discusses the politicization of AI and literature, noting a strong bias towards liberal academics.
Jodie Jenson highlights the significant imbalance, with four liberal academics for every conservative one, leading to a negative portrayal of conservatives.
Jodie mentions a study showing that liberal empathy increases for out-group members, while conservative empathy decreases in conflict-related scenarios.
Edwin and Jodie discuss the potential value of running an empathy circle to reflect on these findings.
Jodie shares her appreciation for the book "In Praise of Intransigence," which highlights historical figures who stood up against fascism.
She expresses concern that academic literature often portrays strong convictions negatively, despite their importance in standing up for values.
Edwin introduces the concept of the empathy circle as a framework for bringing stakeholders together for dialogue, emphasizing the importance of free speech and listening.
He shares examples of successful empathy circles involving pro-life and pro-choice advocates, and political left and right groups.
Edwin explains how the empathy circle creates a space for stakeholders to listen to each other and understand deeper issues.
He discusses the potential for negotiating solutions that address everyone's needs, without giving up core values.
Jodie and Edwin explore the concept of holistic empathy, where empathy is extended to all stakeholders involved in a conflict.
Edwin mentions criticisms of empathy, such as "suicidal empathy" and "toxic empathy," and argues that these issues stem from an empathy deficit.
Jodie and Edwin discuss the challenges of empathizing with multiple groups simultaneously, using the example of immigration and job loss concerns.
Edwin emphasizes the importance of mutual empathy between all stakeholders to address deeper issues.
They explore the concept of the Drama Triangle, where roles of victim, perpetrator, and rescuer create a cycle of conflict.
Edwin shares his experience of mediating between political left and right groups, noting that the political right was often more open to dialogue.
Jodie reads a passage from her notes, highlighting the negative portrayal of conservatives in academic literature.
She contrasts this with her lived experience, noting the strong conservative presence in her community and the importance of understanding both sides.
Edwin suggests defining empathy within the context of the empathy circle to create a clear model for replication.
They discuss the potential for empirical studies to measure the long-term effects of empathy circles on participants' empathy levels.
Jodie inquires about balancing listening and action in leadership roles, asking Edwin how he manages this in his nonprofit organization.
Edwin explains that their meetings often involve both task-oriented activities and empathy circles, aiming to build a culture of empathy.
He describes the restorative empathy circle process, where conflict resolution leads to a plan of action for moving forward.
Edwin mentions other community-based processes, such as people's assemblies, that use empathy to address and propose solutions to community problems.
Jodie explores the overlap between empathy and intellectual humility, noting that openness to learning from others is crucial for empathy.
Edwin agrees, emphasizing that empathic listening leads to a deeper understanding of common humanity.
They discuss the importance of valuing empathy as a continuous process of growth and understanding.
Jodie shares her interest in studying intellectual humility further to better understand its relationship with empathy.
Edwin highlights the practical applications of the empathy circle, such as in conflict mediation and community problem-solving.
He mentions the importance of documenting and role-playing empathy circle processes to make them more tangible and replicable.
Jodie expresses interest in involving herself more with Edwin's organization, either through board membership or training.
They discuss the potential for Jodie to bring the empathy circle to her own community and the benefits of mutual collaboration.
Jodie plans to share her own model of empathy with Edwin, which she developed two years ago.
They discuss the value of mapping different empathy models onto the empathy circle to achieve clarity and understanding.
Edwin emphasizes the importance of having a clear model to ground discussions and ensure practical application.
They agree to continue refining the empathy circle model and exploring its various applications and definitions.